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Twelve yr old commits suicide after taking an Uber. Is Uber at fault? Please share your thoughts.

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momof4
7285 Rider Driver
 Posted 2 weeks, 3 days ago

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https://www.updateamerica.com/uber_may_be_sued_after_12_year_old_girl_gets_ride_alone_dies_from_suicide?fbclid=IwAR3QWqzoANV2l0lgjL-UcBOc5-Kkaf6IvFt2vkE2Nq24-Fpm2TnMPq4EZtg&page=5&utm_medium=RAN&utm_source=UA

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    momof4
    7285 Rider Driver
     2 weeks ago

    Parents do need to accept responsibility. They are placing blame on everyone but themselves. However it is an issue because drivers are not supposed to pick up minors. Although I dont blame Uber or the driver for the girls suicide because neither caused her to do this. I do feel Uber/Lyft need to put something in place to stop minors & parents from requesting rides. As a driver I dont want to waste time & gas only to have to cancel ride. Yes, we collect 3.75 but it also prevents us from possibly getting a more lucrative ride while we are wasting time on these request. If these companies would require ID to make a valid account on the platform it would help not only in the minor issues but would make drivers somewhat more safe. Charge a higher cancel fee on these riders. Once you hit their bank accounts they will stop requesting rides. I want no parts of driving a minor while Uber /Lyft have a policy against it as it will cause me nothing but problems. Just annoyed that they ...

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    Parents do need to accept responsibility. They are placing blame on everyone but themselves. However it is an issue because drivers are not supposed to pick up minors. Although I dont blame Uber or the driver for the girls suicide because neither caused her to do this. I do feel Uber/Lyft need to put something in place to stop minors & parents from requesting rides. As a driver I dont want to waste time & gas only to have to cancel ride. Yes, we collect 3.75 but it also prevents us from possibly getting a more lucrative ride while we are wasting time on these request. If these companies would require ID to make a valid account on the platform it would help not only in the minor issues but would make drivers somewhat more safe. Charge a higher cancel fee on these riders. Once you hit their bank accounts they will stop requesting rides. I want no parts of driving a minor while Uber /Lyft have a policy against it as it will cause me nothing but problems. Just annoyed that they have policies we are supposed to follow but do nothing to enforce it on their end. It is left up to the driver to figure it all out after we pull up to these riders. Usually with an irate parent or teen when you tell them you cant take them. Just so frustrating. I dont care to hear "the last driver did it". Too bad riders dont realize we dont have to do what  the last driver did. The mentality of people still manages to surprise me. Why? I dont know:) Common sense isnt something many people have. Wonder if more will come out about that night? Too many unanswered questions. People need to start taking responsibility for themselves and stop blaming everyone else. Uber and Lyft need to improve on a few things with the app. Drivers need to be careful as no one is going to help us. Not the rideshare companies or their insurance. We are on our own. I still feel parents are sadly mistaken if they think their daughter would still be alive. They are still in denial and dont know much about mental illness. Unfortunately that is why their daughter is no longer here. If the driver said no to the ride that girl wouldnt of went back into the house, went to bed for the night, never to consider suicide again. She needed help something the parents never considered. Sad story for all involved. Lives ruined and changed forever. 

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      RedANT
      978 Rider Driver
       1 week ago  (edited 1 week ago)

      The NO MINORS rule is a RIDESHARE rule, not a legal requirement.  Taxis can transport minors, the only difference is that the taxi companies allow it.  

      Should a driver be fired and sued for unwittingly breaking an Uber company rule and mistaking a minor for an adult?  The precedent set by this will affect us all.  

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        JBurd
        184 Rider
         1 week ago

        Excellent points. The precedence will be huge. 

        And it isn’t illegal. Come on. 

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    T-RabitDriven
    210 Driver
     1 week ago

    I love it how Uber's lawyer was like... "Umm...it's been six month and now you are coming up with this?"

    To the parents.   We understand you are distraught but please stop trying to ruin other people's lives too.

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    Wes
    1555 Rider Driver
     2 weeks ago

    We are currently living in a society where it seems everyone is looking for some else to be at fault!  If she was committed to suicide, wouldn't she have done it no matter what, where or how an "Uber driver" took her.  Yes, we as drivers should know that the minimum age is 18.  And we as drivers have all probably taken someone that is 16-17 for a ride at one time or another.  It is, in my opinion, up to the account owner to be responsible for who requests rides on your account!  Yes, the driver, had he been able to speak English may well have refused to transport her, and yes, if he had refused, she might have been forced to devise an alternate plan, but it is still possible the end result would have been the same.

    It's tragic that anyone commits suicide, and yet it is consistently in the top three causes of death in young people.  Yes, perhaps the Uber driver should have refused her if he was aware of her age, but that is distantly secondary to the reality of her state of mind.

    The parent, and no one else, is responsible for the well being of their 12 year old child!

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    momof4
    7285 Rider Driver
     2 weeks ago  (edited 2 weeks ago)

    Uber is at fault along with Lyft for not making riders sign up on platform with valid US Gov ID. Uber and Lyft are at fault for not removing or suspending a parents acct when they allow their minor child to use it to request an Uber. Uber and Lyft are at fault for leaving it up to driver to figure out if a rider is a minor or not.  Its a drivers fault when they knowingly take a minor child. There are instances where you may not realize a rider is a minor. 

    It all starts with the Uber and Lyft app. When an adult signs up its up to them to read TOS. There they will find that Uber & Lyft state no minors without an adult. Lets just say they dont see it. You are a parent why would you think its safe to send a child with a stranger?  That i dont understand. No way in hell would I send my kids in an Uber without an adult.  Kids have their own acct with their parents debit card. Then there is the driver. Some drivers will cancel and not take these kids others will tak...

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    Uber is at fault along with Lyft for not making riders sign up on platform with valid US Gov ID. Uber and Lyft are at fault for not removing or suspending a parents acct when they allow their minor child to use it to request an Uber. Uber and Lyft are at fault for leaving it up to driver to figure out if a rider is a minor or not.  Its a drivers fault when they knowingly take a minor child. There are instances where you may not realize a rider is a minor. 

    It all starts with the Uber and Lyft app. When an adult signs up its up to them to read TOS. There they will find that Uber & Lyft state no minors without an adult. Lets just say they dont see it. You are a parent why would you think its safe to send a child with a stranger?  That i dont understand. No way in hell would I send my kids in an Uber without an adult.  Kids have their own acct with their parents debit card. Then there is the driver. Some drivers will cancel and not take these kids others will take them. So who is to blame? 

    Parents need to take responsibility for their part. Do not give your kids permission to take U & L. Do not give them access to your rideshare acct or your debit/credit card info. Do not order an Uber or Lyft for them. 

    Drivers do not pick up minors. Too many things can go wrong and eventually will go wrong. 

    Uber and Lyft for not taking action when drivers report the minors trying to take a ride. Not making riders sign up with valid ID. They have been around long enough with many different safety ussues arising over the years. Drivers have given ideas, sent reports, etc... these companies just dont do anything until tragedy strikes. So sad. 

    Uber and Lyft are not totally to blame for this incident. As much as I feel bad for these parents they need to take responsibility also. It was their child they were responsible for. She could've took a bus, cab, etc... if transportation options failed she probably wouldve figured something else out. If the Uber driver said no I think its safe to say she had a plan B. Regardless we will never know.  I just dont feel Uber is 100% at fault. Parents, Uber, and driver each needs to take some responsibility. The only reason I feel driver was at fault because its kind of hard to mistake a 12 yr old as being 18. Had she been 15, 16,17 maybe. Other drivers tell you all the time not to take minors. Was the $10/$20 (probably less) really worth it? 

    Time to step up Uber and Lyft. Make riders sign up with real legit legal ID. Stop allowing people to use other riders accts. Give drivers access to updated pics of our riders with resl names. 

    Drivers cancel minors and send report to UBER snd Lyft. 

    Parents, stop allowing your kids to use Uber and Lyft. Stop ordering Uber and Lyft for your minor children. You are placing them in danger and screwing the driver. Although if you are sending your 10 yr old with a stranger in a car why would you even care that you are screwing the driver? Why is it that the drivers that cancel on minors care more about your child then you do? SMH makes no damn sense.


    Parents, if you are wondering on why you should not send your children in an Uber please read post "Attn Parents, Do You Know Where Your Children Are" in the forum. 




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    SteveBausch
    86
     1 week ago

    Look. This site foreshadowed this over a year ago.

    https://ride.guru/lounge/p/can-a-12-year-old-ride-an-uber-alone 

    The question was literally "

    Can a 12-year-old ride an Uber alone?

    "

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    EjiEzeEze
    313 Rider Driver
     2 weeks ago

    Drivers can't constantly be worried about what will happen to their passengers after they are dropped off.  Please stop pointing fingers about your own problems.

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    AnthonySn.d
    34
     2 weeks ago

    It comes down to whether there was negligence.  I am not sure if a "language barrier" is a negligence. 

    Now, in terms of potential negligence:

    - Driving a minor

    - Dropping a child at a random parking garage.

    - Not capturing her mental state...

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      momof4
      7285 Rider Driver
       2 weeks ago

      Not saying there was a definite language barrier. Just saying maybe they had no conversation just because or made he didnt speak English.  As far as negligence in where he dropped her off I am not understanding that. She could've been meeting a friend, going to friends house but didnt want anyone to know. Whole point of Uber is to drive from point a to point b. Not question why they are going to a particular destination. Its not our business. Not capturing her mental state is definately not an Uber drivers job or concern. Not all people who commit suicide show any emotion. Most times when someone is suicidal family and friends are shocked. Her own parents didnt have a clue. The only thing the driver did wrong is violate Ubers TOS and possibly local city/state laws on picking a minor up. Would I pick that child up? No. Would I have questioned why she was out so late and ordering an Uber? Yes. Where her parents were? Yes. Was she in trouble? Yes. Would I have called the polic...

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      Not saying there was a definite language barrier. Just saying maybe they had no conversation just because or made he didnt speak English.  As far as negligence in where he dropped her off I am not understanding that. She could've been meeting a friend, going to friends house but didnt want anyone to know. Whole point of Uber is to drive from point a to point b. Not question why they are going to a particular destination. Its not our business. Not capturing her mental state is definately not an Uber drivers job or concern. Not all people who commit suicide show any emotion. Most times when someone is suicidal family and friends are shocked. Her own parents didnt have a clue. The only thing the driver did wrong is violate Ubers TOS and possibly local city/state laws on picking a minor up. Would I pick that child up? No. Would I have questioned why she was out so late and ordering an Uber? Yes. Where her parents were? Yes. Was she in trouble? Yes. Would I have called the police? Possibly. Dont really know because I wasnt there and it has never happened to me. Being a parent myself yes I wouldve thought something wasnt right. The last thing I wouldve thought this child was up to was she was headed out to kill herself. I would assume  she was sneaking out to meet a friend. As a human being and a mom yes I wouldve looked into a little more. If the child said ok Ill just go home I wouldve left. Maybe driver has no children, thought she was 15, 16 yrs old. Maybe he was minding his own business like most people do. He was just doing what he was paid to do with the exception of driving a minor. We are not paid to get involved in people's lives or give advice. In most instances people would be pissed if we start getting into their business. Yes she was 12 but lets assume he thought she was 15,16, or 17. None of that would be odd behavior. I am bad at judging peoples ages. Lets say she was dressed a way to make her look older, had make up on, hair done, and driver didnt really look at her when she got in car. There would be no way for him to know what she was planning. I am guilty of just taking a quick glance when rider gets in. I talk to them if they are willing to talk. Some people simply ignore you and dont say a word. Others say hi and thank you and answer "fine or good" when you ask how they are. Three words, how would anyone figure out that their rider was suicidal with only 3 words spoken. As far as the actual drive I am watching the road, GPS, and cars around me. I end the trip and say good night. If Uber or Lyft stacked my ride I leave immediately to head to next pick up. Other than the driver picking up a minor they did nothing wrong. 

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    Bigfrank
    394 Driver Driver Rider
     2 weeks ago

    This is a parent defect not a Uber /driver issue . It is a sad story but not a story that should involve the driver or Uber

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    droneydan
    49 Rider
     2 weeks ago

    12?! That is just devastating, kids are growing up way to fast these days. When I was 12 I do not think I even knew what Suicide was. What are we doing to our children?! And no this is not Ubers fault but the parents who probably pushed this little girl too far. I would like to know what the rest of her note said, I am sure there is a reason the parents did not share that part.

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    ce
    56 Rider
     2 weeks ago

    I feel terrible for these parents and I know they are acting out of grief but it's not Uber's fault that you did not have tabs on your daughter. Perhaps you should have been more aware of her mental health and the fact that she was sneaking out at night.

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    BeMatt
    104 Rider
     2 weeks ago

    Man this is a hard situation. That driver should have never picked up that girl, she is clearly underage but this isn't Uber's fault, it is the drivers. Though I do not believe you can blame this girls suicide on the driver either. Deactivate him from the Uber platform for breaking the minor rule but he didn't lead this girl to her death.

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    RedANT
    978 Rider Driver
     2 weeks ago

    If the kids parents couldn't detect the threat of suicide, how is a rideshare driver supposed to?

    When I pickup in a residential neighborhood in the dark, it's hard, if not impossible, to gauge the age of the person I'm picking up.  Further, with all the recent accusations against inappropriate driver conversations/advances, I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of drivers avoid conversation with female passengers altogether.  How is the driver supposed to know the passengers age?  You can't card the rider.  What do you do if the rider is disabled?  Do you risk refusing to pick her up and getting deactivated?

    Responsibility lies firmly with the kids parents that were around her everyday for the past 12 1/2 years, not the driver who picked her up in the dark and drove her downtown.  

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      momof4
      7285 Rider Driver
       2 weeks ago

      I am awful with ages but  think I wouldve known she was under 18.  I wouldnt have taken her or at very least questioned her. I am sure the driver most definately didnt talk to her. Even if he did not like she would tell him what she was up to. In dealing with an ex husband and patients that were suicidal they wont stop until they are dead. So if driver didnt pick her up she couldve called a taxi or found another way to do it. My question is she used moms phone and a "gift card" she got for Christmas. Was it an Uber gift card? They dont say. She obviously knew how to use app  (not that its difficult). Why did she use her moms phone if she had gift card she couldve downloaded it on her own phone and used gift card? Was she punished and parents took her phone? Lots of unanswered questions. Why wait until 6 mths after the incident to report it to Uber and the press? This driver probably wont remember the trip from 6 months ago. Even if driver had dash cam they p...

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      I am awful with ages but  think I wouldve known she was under 18.  I wouldnt have taken her or at very least questioned her. I am sure the driver most definately didnt talk to her. Even if he did not like she would tell him what she was up to. In dealing with an ex husband and patients that were suicidal they wont stop until they are dead. So if driver didnt pick her up she couldve called a taxi or found another way to do it. My question is she used moms phone and a "gift card" she got for Christmas. Was it an Uber gift card? They dont say. She obviously knew how to use app  (not that its difficult). Why did she use her moms phone if she had gift card she couldve downloaded it on her own phone and used gift card? Was she punished and parents took her phone? Lots of unanswered questions. Why wait until 6 mths after the incident to report it to Uber and the press? This driver probably wont remember the trip from 6 months ago. Even if driver had dash cam they probably only safe 30 or 60 days and delete it after that. Guess another lesson learned dont get rid of any footage for a year. 

       I've picked up a few 16,17 yr olds before I found out we were not allowed. Hell I made every rookie mistake out there my 1st month. I took a 16 yr old few months back. He was 6'4", facial hair, headed to Airport at 3am to fly by himself to Cayman Islands for Olympic trials. Mom was at door said bye to him. I assumed he was in college. Had a intelligent adult conversation. When he told me how old he was and I told him he wasnt allowed to take Uber his jaw dropped along with mine. Lol  At that point we were 25 min into a 55 min trip wasnt dumping him on NJ turnpike at 3am. Knew his mom knew about it and no traffic on road at 3am Sunday morning.  I wouldve never thought he was only 16 yrs old if I didnt hear it come out of his mouth. Hell he tipped me 15.00 cash out of his pocket. Said he enjoyed the trip. Parents had money but were teaching him how to be responsible:)  He definately wasnt your typical 16 yr old. I felt bad told him to use tip $ on his trip he replied "please take it i really want you to have it".  Kid had more common sense and kindness then most adults out there.:)

      Kids also buy fake ID the more $ they pay the better the ID is.  Just like the car seats  its our ass on the line if something goes wrong. Uber and Lyft need to start making riders sign up with valid ID's. It's Lyfts and Ubers platform their TOS that they made up they need to enforce it. It shouldnt fall on drivers. Asking for ID = 1 star.  I also hate leaving these kids stuck late at night. Their parents may not care but I have a conscience and I cant just drive away and leave them. Ended up one time waiting 20 min until parent got there. I glance back when my passenger gets in smile, turn back around then ask how are you and so on. I dont stare at them and try to figure out there age. Like I said I've taken minors a few times not knowing in my rookie days. Now I  turn them down. Sixteen yrs old and up should be able to ride. They can have a job, fly, ride a bus, train, and cab. I have fingerprinted FBI check and child abuse clearance but Uber & Lyft's insurance wont cover us. Luckily I dont get teens very often. Never had anyone younger than 16 either request a ride. 

      Maybe if they would charge these kids or the parents who order for them 10.00 cancel fee 20.00 the 2nd time and so on bet they would stop then. Its a win win for Uber and Lyft we take them get them there safely U and L get their 35%/45%. We get in an accident they deactivate us & insurance dont pay. You know this will end up all falling on that driver.  At the very least he will need a lawyer and get deactivated.  I hate to say this because nobody deserves to have their child die but parents need to accept most of the responsibility on this one. Uber could easily make it very difficult for this to even be an issue. I do have to say driver needs to take some responsibility for not questioning her age. This subject is all over forums, you tube, web sites, FB. Some drivers admit taking kids and just dont care. They will the day they get sued. Twelve is on the young side to think she was 18. Maybe hair, make up, and clothes worn threw driver off. Although I would think you would still notice. Unless driver never even looked back at the girl when she got in. Which is very possible. Usually females are not a threat. Maybe driver didnt speak English so no words were exchanged at all. All i know is Uber and Lyft needs to do something with riders with no car seats, minors, and overall safety for drivers. I dont think the girl would still be alive. I think they are wrong in thinking that. She set out to kill herself that night. She was in a dark place in her mind. She needed professional help. Lets say driver did cancel she wouldve found another way to kill herself. The driver is under no obligation to knock on parents door and say "your underage daughter is trying to take an Uber".  They cancel and move on. That driver had no idea what she was up to hell her own parents didnt have a clue.  Hate to say this but either looking for someone to blame (kind of understand why, part of grief process blame) or a payout. The reason I say the payout is because there is many questions that are not answered. The biggest ine being as I mentioned why wait 6 months to notify Uber and the press? Just like the young lady that got killed few months back. Few questions there also that never were answered or addressed. Thanks for commenting RedAnt. Enjoy reading your comments. Always to the point and spot on:)  Still kind of wondering about that post about the Uber driver who dropped the 50 something ladies. Unanswered questions there also maybe some of the stiry missing:) who knows. Lol  

      How was your trip?

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