RIDEGURU
Even calling into a customer service call (at a bank or whatever), we have the choice of asking not to be recorded. What about with rideshares like Uber and Lyft?
I understand that the car is a private property, and drivers have the rights to record inside their cabin. However, do I have the right to not be recorded upon request?
Comments
If you are camera shy, I think you are out of luck on this one. There is no doubt we are entitled to some expectations of privacy; however, this is a public place (just like on a subway or public bus). The driver is not recording YOU. The driver is in fact recording a space. The fact that you move into that space does not entitle you to change that space or the fact that it is being recorded. You entering that space willingly infers consent, particularly if the camera is clearly visible or signs clearly announce the video/audio recording of the space. The purpose of the recording is to document the space as to who entered it, what they did and what happened to them as a result. You have the right to not be recorded and can stop that at any time by leaving the space (canceling the ride and getting out of the car). It is kind of like a surveillance at the back door of a building. If you walk by on the sidewalk into the field of vision of the camera, do you have the right to tell the own…
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If you are camera shy, I think you are out of luck on this one. There is no doubt we are entitled to some expectations of privacy; however, this is a public place (just like on a subway or public bus). The driver is not recording YOU. The driver is in fact recording a space. The fact that you move into that space does not entitle you to change that space or the fact that it is being recorded. You entering that space willingly infers consent, particularly if the camera is clearly visible or signs clearly announce the video/audio recording of the space. The purpose of the recording is to document the space as to who entered it, what they did and what happened to them as a result. You have the right to not be recorded and can stop that at any time by leaving the space (canceling the ride and getting out of the car). It is kind of like a surveillance at the back door of a building. If you walk by on the sidewalk into the field of vision of the camera, do you have the right to tell the owner of the building to turn off the camera because you don't want to be recorded. Nah. I don't think so. The purpose of the documenting video is to show the fact that you were there.
The driver has the absolute right to video the space. Not only from a liability standpoint but also to provide security and for the protection of the driver and rider. No rights you have in this arena supersede that.
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Thank you for the response. Yes, I understand that drivers have rights to record their space. I was curious if there was a way to request not to be recorded, but I guess that would defeat the purpose. If that were the case, all crooks will ask that the camera be turned off before attacking and/or robbing the driver, huh?
Anonymousity is pretty much gone riding a taxi, but I do consider that as a good thing, not a bad thing. I am not doing anything, say like cheating on a wife, and I suppose for one I shouldn't worry that my trips are being documented and for two that I am being recorded.
I wonder what celebrities do.
A lot of drivers will respect your wishes but remember that can cause the driver to have you removed from their property. The driver most likely will just pull over in a safe area and ask you respectfully to leave. A vehicle is considered someone's private property and being inside of a vehicle and refusing to leave in many jurisdictions can be considered trespassing. Oftentimes these misunderstandings can be avoided by explaining what your privacy policy is. For example I had one guest you wanted me to do it but I didn't have to end the trip. I told her that I am out here doing ride-sharing and I'm pretty much by myself. This is for your Safety and Security as well as everybody else's. I told her the footage is kept private unless an incident comes up to where I have to turn it over to the Rideshare company, appropriate regulatory bodies, law enforcement, or to any appropriate individual if a court proceeding happens. Other than that it's confidential and it's…
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A lot of drivers will respect your wishes but remember that can cause the driver to have you removed from their property. The driver most likely will just pull over in a safe area and ask you respectfully to leave. A vehicle is considered someone's private property and being inside of a vehicle and refusing to leave in many jurisdictions can be considered trespassing. Oftentimes these misunderstandings can be avoided by explaining what your privacy policy is. For example I had one guest you wanted me to do it but I didn't have to end the trip. I told her that I am out here doing ride-sharing and I'm pretty much by myself. This is for your Safety and Security as well as everybody else's. I told her the footage is kept private unless an incident comes up to where I have to turn it over to the Rideshare company, appropriate regulatory bodies, law enforcement, or to any appropriate individual if a court proceeding happens. Other than that it's confidential and it's on a loop and as long as there's no problem the footage will be recorded over. I haven't had someone be uncomfortable but the one who was I was able to calm them down and they were actually very apologetic and they understood my position.
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I agree with everything you mentioned, but this reminds me of the critical difference between rideshare services and public transportation, i.e. the fact that the rideshare vehicles are private properties and public transportation vehicles (like buses and trains) are NOT. Plus the latter cannot deny service.
The interesting thing is that you can still be recorded while on a bus or a train because, ironically, you are in a public space and anyone can record you (as you have no expectation of privacy).
Oh
Your car is not a public place. The car is in a public place. Recording people on the street uses the public recording laws. Recording in your car falls under private property laws. Both ways side with the driver.
This is correct. Your car is a private space. This is why the police cannot randomly search it and need consent (or a warrant). all that applies.
When your car is being used as a ride share, it is operating under a carrier license held by Uber/Lyft. It is no different than a bus or subway, all of which are public places in the legal context.
That's not entirely accurate and will vary by state. I'm not a lawyer but my understanding from researching this in my state is as follows.
Uber/Lyft is operating under an emergency injunction and are sort of lumped in with taxi cabs, as they should be, but they don't adhere to the same rules.
The major difference is taxi cabs are limited to a maximum flat rate (more than I get paid per pickup/mile/minute, less than riders pay, even without surge pricing), and marking the vehicle with the company's name, a vehicle number, and the carrier number. This is the same for a Federal Motor Carrier License number; the M.C.U. numbers you see on EVERY COMMERCIAL VEHICLE THAT CONDUCTS INTRASTATE COMMERCE.
I don't have either of those. And the "carrier license" they have in this state is just a temporary assurance that they keep on file proof of insurance, license, and state vehicle inspection on file, as well as background checks and their own insurance as a redun…
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That's not entirely accurate and will vary by state. I'm not a lawyer but my understanding from researching this in my state is as follows.
Uber/Lyft is operating under an emergency injunction and are sort of lumped in with taxi cabs, as they should be, but they don't adhere to the same rules.
The major difference is taxi cabs are limited to a maximum flat rate (more than I get paid per pickup/mile/minute, less than riders pay, even without surge pricing), and marking the vehicle with the company's name, a vehicle number, and the carrier number. This is the same for a Federal Motor Carrier License number; the M.C.U. numbers you see on EVERY COMMERCIAL VEHICLE THAT CONDUCTS INTRASTATE COMMERCE.
I don't have either of those. And the "carrier license" they have in this state is just a temporary assurance that they keep on file proof of insurance, license, and state vehicle inspection on file, as well as background checks and their own insurance as a redundacy.
Busses might be considered as a "public space" by the understanding of the general public but it's still private property owned by a private entity, just like any place of business. It is not owned by a public entity (i.e. government). You're confusing publicly owned with open to the public.
Busses and subways have cameras that you can't object to being filmed by, they have the right eject you from the premise, rights to refusal of service, and the rights to hold you accountable for damages (restitution and criminal charges.
Some states do require written notices of recording in progress be posted to alert people they are being watched, no state disallows a business from having cameras, regardless if it's a "public space".
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Revisiting this thread. After working a while I would say you have a right to ask. These cameras loop and if not saved they files write over themselves after a few hours. After the year I have had, I might just cancel the ride. I have been assaulted multiple times, including sexually... I have been accused of things and videoed by malicious customers trying to get a tick tock.. . unsuccessfully I might add. Only due to my dashcam showing what really happened. My LIFE and livelihood and ability to pay rent and buy food are on the line. More and more drivers are using dashcams and for good reason. I would have to size you up first before offering to turn the camera off. My line in the sand is firmer than it was a few years ago... and the answer would be not very likely. Ask, but be prepared to have the driver drive off without you. There is no point in doing the ride because you are going to rate me a one if I take you and do not turn it off... And I am not going to take the chance that I will not get into an accident or you will not be abusive if I turn it off.
To be honest, if someone asked me to turn off my camera I would be even MORE inclined to keep it on. I would immediately think they are up to no good!
I actually just got out of a lyft car and didn’t see a sign on the door that said there was video and audio in the car. Had I known I wouldn’t have gotten in the car. I asked lyft if it was illegal to audio someone without their verbal which is it against the wiretapping law. They can video record but not audio without consent. This is what lyft emailed me back about the situation.![]()
I recently added a dash cam to my car for my safety. As a driver we really dont have anything to protect us. If we were to be assulted it would be nIce to have proof of the assult along with a video of who the person was. Lyft and Uber allow riders to use fake names. We dont have a clue who we are picking up. A pregnant woman was stabbed to death along with her baby a few months back, another driver was shot to death a few weeks ago, there are many other stories out there of drivers getting assulted or fake accusations made against drivers are being sent to Uber and Lyft. How can anyone report a driver or complain about the dash cam knowing its for their safety? Everywhere you go stores, streets, on top of traffic lights, bars, etc you are being recorded. There is also some employers using cameras to record their employees. There is no getting away from being recorded wherever you go. Drivers are far from being safe picking up riders (strangers) and riders often make fake …
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I recently added a dash cam to my car for my safety. As a driver we really dont have anything to protect us. If we were to be assulted it would be nIce to have proof of the assult along with a video of who the person was. Lyft and Uber allow riders to use fake names. We dont have a clue who we are picking up. A pregnant woman was stabbed to death along with her baby a few months back, another driver was shot to death a few weeks ago, there are many other stories out there of drivers getting assulted or fake accusations made against drivers are being sent to Uber and Lyft. How can anyone report a driver or complain about the dash cam knowing its for their safety? Everywhere you go stores, streets, on top of traffic lights, bars, etc you are being recorded. There is also some employers using cameras to record their employees. There is no getting away from being recorded wherever you go. Drivers are far from being safe picking up riders (strangers) and riders often make fake accusations against drivers causing them to be deactivated. Dash cams are our only proof of what really happened. I have to ask what are you saying or doing in an Uber that concerns you being recorded? If a rider cant understand why a driver needs a dash cam I suggest they choose a different mode of transportation. Just an FYI I believe public transit and taxi's also uses cameras.
I dont care to be recorded as its somewhat uncomfortable however I understand the need for it. My camera is visible for all to see. I save my footage for 30 days and then its erased. I have not had the need to review the footage. I could care less whats on there and dont have the time to watch it. It's strictly there for safety reasons.
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It depends on the state. In states where it's a one party consent state, you are not required to be notified of any recording, audio or video. If it is a two party consent state, you must give your permission to be recorded.
Shannon you are a jerk.. you are messing with the drivers life and job because of some nonsense that you think you are entitled to be special. do you walk around your city telling every business, store, walgreens, bank gas station, library public streets that you don't want to be recorded? do you spend your days complaining to managers of every business you enter all over your city about cameras? this was uncalled for.. Lyft should cancel your account not his.
Agreed!
If you didn’t see a sign, how did you know your audio was being recorded?
Thank you for posting this.
I wasn’t fully paying attention to the sign when I got in the car. I thought it was just another lyft sticker or a business sticker. But it said that the ride was being video and audio recorded.
If you were my rider and you did this to me messing with my job I would sue the sh out of you.
Got it. I can see that happening.
People like this Karen need to be slapped and dropped off in the middle of nowhere. Your coming in MY CAR, if you don't like to be recorded then KICK ROCKS. It's because of riders like this why drivers get deactivated. If you Karen's don't like rideshare rules go kick rocks or use public transportation
The answer depends on the state actually. This is obviously to do with consent, and how it affects the privacy.
Here's a good explanation of what I found. It talks to how some states require two-party consent vs. one-party consent.
"Everything comes back to state law. The United States has a federal law regarding filming people without their consent, but it’s a little more complex than just yes or no. Things get even more complicated when it’s a car owned and operated by a private citizen. Gargac told the St. Louis Post-Dispatch that he doesn’t consider people riding in another person’s car a private place — because it isn’t their property.
“I have sex in my bedroom,” Gargac said. “I don’t have sex in strangers’ cars. Because I have a reasonable expectation of privacy in the bedroom in my own house. I don’t have that in a stranger’s car.”
Missouri, where Gargac lives, operates on one-pa…
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The answer depends on the state actually. This is obviously to do with consent, and how it affects the privacy.
Here's a good explanation of what I found. It talks to how some states require two-party consent vs. one-party consent.
"Everything comes back to state law. The United States has a federal law regarding filming people without their consent, but it’s a little more complex than just yes or no. Things get even more complicated when it’s a car owned and operated by a private citizen. Gargac told the St. Louis Post-Dispatch that he doesn’t consider people riding in another person’s car a private place — because it isn’t their property.
“I have sex in my bedroom,” Gargac said. “I don’t have sex in strangers’ cars. Because I have a reasonable expectation of privacy in the bedroom in my own house. I don’t have that in a stranger’s car.”
Missouri, where Gargac lives, operates on one-party consent laws, which state people “can record a phone call or conversation so long as you are a party to the conversation,” according to the Digital Media Law Project. Thirty-nine other states also have one-party consent laws regarding such recording activities.
Considering the conversation took place in Gargac’s car, and therefore in his vicinity, he is a member of the party. Since he consented to the video, it’s fine to record and stream, even if his passengers are unaware. California, Connecticut, Florida, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, Montana, New Hampshire, Pennsylvania and Washington abide by two-party consent laws, which means that both parties must agree to being recorded. (source)"
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No, you do not have that right. Your sole right is to cancel the ride (and pay the cancel fee), by which I mean, sure you can ask,but I do not have to turn it off. And in 5000 rides no one has ever asked.
Also, you don't have that right when you call customer service either (though state laws vary, I am citing California law) — they "announce" that the call may be monitored, and then they record you. You don't get an opt-out other than to hang up.
I have the cameras in my car for INSURANCE purposes, to record any accidents. I am not going to turn them off for anyone.
Similarly, you cannot walk into McD…
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No, you do not have that right. Your sole right is to cancel the ride (and pay the cancel fee), by which I mean, sure you can ask,but I do not have to turn it off. And in 5000 rides no one has ever asked.
Also, you don't have that right when you call customer service either (though state laws vary, I am citing California law) — they "announce" that the call may be monitored, and then they record you. You don't get an opt-out other than to hang up.
I have the cameras in my car for INSURANCE purposes, to record any accidents. I am not going to turn them off for anyone.
Similarly, you cannot walk into McDonald's and say "I wanna BigMac, but I want you to turn off your security cameras first."
Do you appreciate how ridiculous that sounds?
WHY I RECORD:
My first camera was a $36 cheepie from amazon, and a WEEK after I installed it, a jerk hit me, and tried to claim it was my fault. LOL. I had the camera, and gave the footage to my insurance company. I won and saved OVER $3000 as I got my full deductible back and my rates did NOT go up at all.
Best $36 I ever spent... er... well, best return on $36 at least, LOL...
I added another better camera after than, so front and back are covered.
LAW:
In many states (single party consent) the driver does not need your permission AT ALL.
In "two party" states, then all that are parties to the conversation "must consent", but "consent" is not the same as "agree". Consent to be recorded includes "implied consent" such as continuing to talk even though you know you are being recorded, or talking in a public place where the is no "expectation of privacy".
How This Will Work Out For You
If you tell me that you want the cameras turned off, I tell you "we can end the ride". Keep in mind that you are not entitled to a ride with me, and I can cancel the ride for nearly any reason (there are certain Federal reasons I can't, but they are few).
So fine, get out and wait for the next driver, and don't worry I will have your account blocked so you'll never see me again, thanks.
The Upshot
WHAT YOU ARE DOING is making an unreasonable and entitled demand that puts the driver (ME) directly at risk, and I will not allow you to do that. I am at risk driving without cameras if an accident occurs, or if a passenger does something illegal. I don't know you. You were not required to get a background check before becoming my passenger. I don't even have any way to ID you other than the name you give me.
Who's at more risk here?
Thank you for understanding.
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Well, she does have the right to ask. ;) The driver may say no, but she can still verbalize the request.
I said as much, but I generally suggest against passengers making such a ridiculous request. Low ratings can cause a driver to get fired, so it's common to cancel on a passenger that is being "problematic" as problematic passengers give low ratings.
Wise advice.
In two party states (I am from PA, which has some of the strictest two party consent laws) you will be reprimanded by HQ if there is a complaint about being recorded against a passengers will. Yes you can cancel, but nothing will happen to the passengers account and they WILL be refunded. It is NOT unreasonable to ask to not be recorded. Every place you mentioned: restaurant, McDonald's etc, is only allowed to record video. Sound recordings in private establishments that cater to the public are illegal without consent. So your place of buisness is no different. As long as there is an exchange between a driver and a passenger, it is considered a private conversation that cannot be recorded. You're attitude makes me think you shouldn't work with the public.
With proper signage, no verbal or actual record of consent is needed. All one needs is to notify that a premises, in this case a vehicle, is under visual and audio recording and consent is given by entering the vehicle. This can be done via a sign posted conspicuously. Try again.
Everyone is talking about consent and whether the driver can or cannot record. However, the question is about whether the passenger can say NO to being recorded. Isn’t that a whole another legal question?
I’d like to say, “yes, of course”, but I’m sure drivers would argue they need to record for their safety and that they have the right to record in their vehicle. (And they have a point.)
Interesting topic.
Passengers are absolutely allowed to say they don’t want to be recorded. Do they have a legal right? Maybe, but it means that they don’t get to use a provider of a service wherein recording is taking place. They would have to walk away from the service. Especially in my car, cause I’m not turning it off.
In some states "consent" is required from both parties. In other states only one party (the driver) needs to consent to record legally.
For me, I post a sign "Security cameras are in use for the protection of all and to prevent fraud" By entering my vehicle, one consents to be recorded. If a rider says that they don't consent, I'll immediately kick them from my vehicle and comment to Uber/Lyft that I did so for safety issues.
I don't know the people in my cars. My safety isn't worth the risk.
I've only had one rider complain about being recorded. Even after I explained that it was fr their safety as well as mine, they objected to being recorded. I immediately pulled over to the side of the road and said that he should get another ride as I was not going to turn off the camera. He decided to finish the ride but then complained to Uber. I told Uber what had happened and told them I had him recorded accepting the ride even though he would be recorded, but they didn't care. I said, OK, but I would continue to record all future rides. That was a year ago and I'm still driving and recording!
I use to have my dashcam screen on recording through windshield and through the interior. This was often a conversation piece in itself, later however I enabled a screensaver so now 99% of passengers do not even notice the camera, however if anyone asked me to stop recording I too would offer them to get out and look for alternate method to contiune their journey
When I have a passenger like that I end the ride — if it is close enough (less than a block or two) it becomes a cancel instead and they cannot rate the ride.
In "two party" states, then all that are parties to the conversation "must consent", but "consent" is not the same as "agree". Consent to be recorded includes "implied consent" such as continuing to talk even though you know you are being recorded, or talking in a public place where the is no "expectation of privacy".
If you ask me to turn it off I will tell you I can't due to insurance reasons, and if would you prefer another driver I am happy to cancel the ride. No one has ever asked in 5000 rides.
Where do you post the sign? Shouldn't someone just claim that they didn't see the sign?
Hi, I drive primarily in PA and it is a two party consent state. Some say make a lael and place it on the inside of the sunvisor next to airbag warning. However, if your DashCam is in plain view you are not secretly recording. Actually found this article here:
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a32124/the-surprising-legal-ramifications-of-having-a-dash-cam-in-your-car/
Where it states:
While most people get their dash cams so they record the view through their windshield, dash cams often record audio from inside the passenger compartment as well. In Michigan [Two-Party Consent State], courts have ruled that a person can record a conversation to which they are a party regardless of the other parties to the conversation knowing or giving consent in advance. So, if you have a dash cam in your own car and it is recording while you drive, you have no problem since you are a "party" to any conversation going on in your car.
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If you say "hello" to the passenger, you are a party to the conversation:)
You said:
And that, by definition, makes it a one party state.
Thank you for the info. helpful.
I mount a Google Nexus 7 tablet on the back of the passenger headrest, and use it to display an illuminated sign that's right in front of the passengers face. If they know I'm recording, it's because they saw the sign. Recording from the tablet is looped (6hrs @ 720p) so I get a clear record of the back seat, and in tandem I also record the entire cabin from the 10" Galaxy Tab that I use for navigation. If people ask where the dashcam is, I tell em' it's hidden for security reasons. They've always agreed that that's a smart idea.
Great sign, did you make it? Have you found the camera footage to come in handy?
You have a right to refuse to be recorded. I have a right to refuse you service.
Dashcams offer us evidence in case of an accident or a false report from a rider. Although I'm sure you are a nice person, I personally would not feel comfortable turning off my dashcam and recorder to give you a ride because in this instance, if ANYTHING does happen it would look EXTRA suspicious because I turned my dashcam off; which to a jury may look like I intended to commit a crime (regardless of whether I did or not).
Depending on the driver, and how you ask, I think most drivers would still give you a ride.
In two party consent states( PA specifically), it's safer for drivers to have video only cameras. At the first moment of verbal exchange between passenger and driver it would be considered a private conversation committed on private property. Anything recorded wouldn't be able to be used as evidence and if used in the court of law could result in you being personally sued to up to $15000 and possibly even jail time.
Yes, this has been the first thingI I purchased since I became a driver one that has an SD Card and I even rigged a land based camera to record directly to the net using an online account. This way if a criminal grabs what he thinks is the camera containi video evidence via an onboard card containing evidence of a crime he/she committed in the vehicle by him/her they won’t be able to get their hands on the evidence against them if it streamed to the cloud.
In the event someone asks not to be recorded the answer will always be YES! Although this has never been asked in over 2,700 rides with Uber and Lyft. If the occasion ever arises in the future or If this ever is requested by a rider the answer will be “of course I will stop recording you” (as I pull over to a safe public location. “At this point i will leave no option for them to stay. They mist exit immediately preferably in a safe place, i would grab my cell phone and Car keys l…
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Yes, this has been the first thingI I purchased since I became a driver one that has an SD Card and I even rigged a land based camera to record directly to the net using an online account. This way if a criminal grabs what he thinks is the camera containi video evidence via an onboard card containing evidence of a crime he/she committed in the vehicle by him/her they won’t be able to get their hands on the evidence against them if it streamed to the cloud.
In the event someone asks not to be recorded the answer will always be YES! Although this has never been asked in over 2,700 rides with Uber and Lyft. If the occasion ever arises in the future or If this ever is requested by a rider the answer will be “of course I will stop recording you” (as I pull over to a safe public location. “At this point i will leave no option for them to stay. They mist exit immediately preferably in a safe place, i would grab my cell phone and Car keys leave and call 911 . With police on the way and me safely out of the vehicle any potentially dangerous situation can be aliviiated.
Anyone who objects to be filmed in my car would be regarded by me as extremely dangerous and to be treated as if they are a serial killer with intention to abduct, etc. believe me its happened to ride share drivers before. ( https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/us/uber-driver-found-dead-after-missing-for-8-weeks-2nd-rideshare-driver-found-dead-in-same-region-within-week.amp)
(: https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=TlykXOC6K4metAXtz6PwAw&q=uber+driver+found+mirdered&oq=uber+driver+found+mirdered&gs_l=mobile-gws-wiz-hp.3..33i160.2448.11335..12341...1.0..0.199.2734.17j9......0....1.......8..35i39j46j0i131j46i131j0j0i3j33i22i29i30j0i22i30.E5rEaOlk0WY). Reported to the ride share company as someone who made me feel very uncomfortable. After all what do they have to hide? Everything!!!
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Conversations dealing with sensitive material. Anything to do with a subject protected by a NDA etc. If you have recorded audio of them at all you could be fined up to $15000 and serve three years in jail. You should probably find a camera without audio
You should stop giving out bad advice. As long as the person is notified and continues or moves forward with the ride, they have given consent. NDAs have to be signed in order to be bound by them. If someone talks about sensitive information in front of another individual that isn’t cleared to overhear said sensitive information, the person speaking is at fault not the person overhearing.
Federal law mandates no, you can't demand they turn off their cameras.
You wouldn't be able to sue your friend because you were at their house and their security camera recorded you.
Nor could you walk into a store and demand they shut off their cameras.
Neither Uber nor Lyft have any legal claim to a driver's vehicle, which is recognized by the Federal government as private property. That is the same law that requires law enforcement to have either permission, a warrant, or probable cause to legally justify entering and searching your vehicle.
As such, if your rideshare driver tells you to get out of their car, and you don't, you are officially trespassing at that point. Your state's laws pertaining to protection of property and self defense and even "stand your ground" laws dictate what the driver can legally do.
Don't be a bad rider. Drivers have rights. More than you do in this situation. Remember that.
The laws between recording bideo and laws a vastly different. Once verbal exchange occurs between the passenger and the driver, it is considered a private conversation that is protected in two party consent states. Buisness that cater to the public in those states are only allowed to record video with no audio.
As few other posters mentioned, there is such thing as a expectation of privacy. When you go to someone's house (their private property), you expect that you won't be recorded in the bathrooms or have a camera up your skirt while sitting on a couch. The same applies for people's cars. I think.
Closely related is the rules on consent. Most require your consent, and this sets the expectation of privacy. So using the above example, if you have a sign that says "you will be recorded in the bathroom", it makes it okay.
(So technically, I guess you are right. You can do whatever you want on your property, but you just need consent. - in most localities. )
Is inside of your car even a private property? Isn't it public sort of a public place?
You can't just do whatever you want in middle of a city block just because you are in your car, righit?
You can certainly ask. It may come across as suspicious or rude to some drivers but that is just the risk you will have to take. You can also ask them if they have the option to turn off the cab facing part of dashcam. The meter is running and it may take a minute or two for the driver to adjust their dashcam.
As as driver I would cancel the ride if the rider wanted me to turn off my camera, a camera is the only protection you have against allegations or evidence in a accident.
THIS IS VERY SIMPLE AND STRAIGHTFORWARD! VERY UNSURE WHY EVERYONE IS SO CONFUSED THINKING THERES MANY DIFFERENT SCENARIOS THAT WOULD AFFECT THE LEGALITY AND POLICY OF A UBER DRIVER RECORDING VIDEO AND OR AUDIO OF THE DRIVERS VEHICLE AND ANYONE INSIDE IT INCLUDING RECORDING ANY CONVERSATION BETWEEN THE DRIVER AND ANY VEHICLE OCCUPANTS. GONNA LAY OUT SOME POINTS HERE TO MAKE THIS VERY SIMPLE.
Q1 ( WHATS UBERS FORMAL POLICY REGARDING DRIVERS RECORDING VIDEO AND AUDIO YES AUDIO AS WELL IN THERE VEHICLE DURING TRIPS.
A1. ( Uber allows driver-partners to install and use video cameras, dash cams, or other recording devices to record riders for purpose of fulfilling transportation services.
Please note that local regulations may require individuals using recording equipment in vehicles to fully disclose to riders that they are being recorded in or around a vehicle and obtain consent. Please check local regulations in your city to determine if these apply. UBER SAYS YES YOU CAN RECORD…
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THIS IS VERY SIMPLE AND STRAIGHTFORWARD! VERY UNSURE WHY EVERYONE IS SO CONFUSED THINKING THERES MANY DIFFERENT SCENARIOS THAT WOULD AFFECT THE LEGALITY AND POLICY OF A UBER DRIVER RECORDING VIDEO AND OR AUDIO OF THE DRIVERS VEHICLE AND ANYONE INSIDE IT INCLUDING RECORDING ANY CONVERSATION BETWEEN THE DRIVER AND ANY VEHICLE OCCUPANTS. GONNA LAY OUT SOME POINTS HERE TO MAKE THIS VERY SIMPLE.
Q1 ( WHATS UBERS FORMAL POLICY REGARDING DRIVERS RECORDING VIDEO AND AUDIO YES AUDIO AS WELL IN THERE VEHICLE DURING TRIPS.
A1. ( Uber allows driver-partners to install and use video cameras, dash cams, or other recording devices to record riders for purpose of fulfilling transportation services.
Please note that local regulations may require individuals using recording equipment in vehicles to fully disclose to riders that they are being recorded in or around a vehicle and obtain consent. Please check local regulations in your city to determine if these apply. UBER SAYS YES YOU CAN RECORD VIDEO PERIOD YOU AS A RIDER AGREED TO THIS IN THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS UBER ALSO SAYS YOU CAN RECORD AUDIO AS LONG AS YOU ARE WITHIN THE STATE LAW YOU ARE IN, AND YOU MIGHT OR MAY HAVE TO DISCLOSE OR EVEN GET CONSENT FROM ALL PARTIES, CHECK WITH THE STATE LAW TO SEE IF THIS APPLYS TO YOU.
Q2 DOES MY STATE REQUIRE ANY OF THESE FOLLOWING STATEMENT STATE REQUIRES THAT ANYONE BEING RECORDED TO BE NOTIFIED THERE BEING RECORDED AKA A SIGN SAYING VEHICLE IS SUBJECT TO RECORDING OF VIDEO/AUDIO ECT DEPENDING ON YOUR STATE IF IT IS EITHER A ONE PARTY CONSENT OR TWO PARTY CONSENT STATE IN ORDER TO CONDUCT AUDIO SURVEILLANCE, IN A ONE PARTY STATE ONLY ONE PERSON NEEDS TO CONSENT TO AUDIO SURVEILLANCE AND THAT ONE PARTY IS THE DRIVER AND YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PUT UP ANY SIGNS OR GET CONSENT OR DISCLOSE OR DO ANYTHING AT ALL AND HAVE EVERY RIGHF TO RECORD VIDEO AND AUDIO OF YOURSELF IN YOUR CAR AND ANY CONVERSATION OR STATEMENTS MADE IN YOUR VEHICLE AS YOU ARE ONE OF THE PARTIES AND HAVE GUVEN CONSENT. ONE PARTY STATES WHERE IF YOU GET INSIDE A UBER YOU CAN LEGALLY BE FILMED AND RECORDED AUDIO WITHOUT EVEN KNOWING ITS HAPPENING. YOU DO NOT HAVE ANY RUGHT TO TELL THE DRIVER NOT TO RECORD YOU OR HAVE ANY RIGHT TO TRY TO GET THEM IN TROUBLE THROUGH UBER FOR SOMETHING THATS BS NUST CUZ YOU DONT LIKE THE LAWS AND POLICY. IF YOU DONT WANT YOUR AUDIO TO BE RECORDED IN A ONE PARTY STATE WHILE IN A UBER THAN DOT TAKE AN UBER. YOU CAN BE VIDEO TAPED IN AN UBER IN ALL STATES ITS NO DIFFERENT THAN BEING TAPED AT A BEST BUY STORE OR ANY STORE ANYWHERE. BUT AUDIO RECORDING IN A ONE PARTY STATE DOES NOT NEED YOUR APPROVAL OR KNOWLEDGE AND IS WITHIN THE POLICY OF UBER THAT YOU ALSO AGREED TOO EVEB THO IT WAS NOT NECESSARY WHEN YOU SIGNED UP.
list of states that are one party consent WHERE YOU CAN BE RECORDED VIDEO AND AUDIO WITHOUT BEING TOLD AT ALL.
One-Party Consent States AS LONG AS THE PERSON RECORDING IS PART OF WHATS BEING RECORDED THEY DONT NEED ANYONES PERMISSION TO RECORD AUDIO.
THAT ALL PARTIES GIVE CONSENT AND AGREE TO BE RECORDED.ALSO COULD BE A SIGN OR BE VERBALLY STATING THE VEHICLE IS BEING RECORDED AND BY ENTERING THE VEHICLE YOU CONSENT TO BEING RECORDED ON A SIGN OR STICKER ON WINDOW OR HEADREST. THIS WOULD CLASSIFY AS A TWO PARTY STATE. MEANING THAT IN ADDITION TO MYSELF THE DRIVER WHOS DOING THE RECORDING AND BEING RECORDED AS ONE OF THE PARTIES IN THE CONVERSATION ANYONE WHO IS ALSO BEING RECORDED MUST BE AWARE AND GIVE CONSENT TO BE RECORDED, A SIGN VISIBLE WHILE ENTERING THE VEHICLE SATES BY ENTERING THIS VEHICLE YOU CONSENT TO BE RECORDED BOTH AUDIO AND VIDEO. And it’s your choice if you want to take an Uber or not. Would be fine. ITS KEY THAT ITS CLEAR THAT ALL PARTIES COULD CLEARLY SEE ANY SIGNS OR ARE SOMEHOW INFORMED IN A WAY THAT THERES NO DOUBT THEY WERE INFORMED AND GAVE CONSENT BY VERBALLY OR BY THERE ACTIONS. These states that require all Peru consent.
All-Party Consent States
These states clearly or potentially require consent from all parties under some or all circumstances:
AT THE END OF THE DAY IF YOU DONT WANT TO TAKE THE CHANCE OF BEING RECORDED THAN DONT GO OUT IN PUBLIC. DONT TAKE AN UBER. AND EVEN IF YOU LIGE IN AN ALL PARTY STATE AND THINK YOU WILL ONLY GET IN AN UBER THAT ISNT RECORDING AS OF late 2019 UBER HAS ANNOUNCED IT IS BEGINNING TO ROLL OUT A NEW PROGRAM WHERE UBER WILL BE RECORDING THE AUDIO FROM YOUR PHONE DURING THE UBER TRIP IN THE USA REGARDLESS OF WHAT-VERSION OF PARTY-CONSENT STATE YOU RESIDE IN, UBER WILL MAKEYOU CHECK A BOX SAYING YOU CONSENT BEFORE YOU CAN ORDER AN UBER OR INCLUDE IT FURTHER INTO THE-TERMS AND CONDITIONS.
so when your in your next Uber smile for the camera and make sure to give your Uber driver 5 Stars and a 30% tip!
Link to Uber’s policy on recording a trip
https://help.uber.com/partners/article/can-i-use-a-video-camera-?nodeId=efaad152-cbb6-45fe-9d7d-911842d21c8b
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Very good post. I've been driving for Uber about a week pulled up to a bar had a woman get in who was not my pickup. My rider was waiting for me to get this person out of car. Video and audio saved me as I just called the police to have her removed she claimed all kinds of crap police reviewed video sent me on my way while she was arrested for public intoxication. I will never agree to turn off my camera or audio this is a perfect example of why we need one in the first place.
Since it is the drivers personal vehicle they have the right to record you. Just don't do anything you wouldnt want on camera :)
I don't think it's possible. They do that for safety first of all
Depends where you are. In PA, it is a two party consent state. As in you need to inform all parties that sound is being recorded. I have ridden before and had an issue because I had to have a conversation about sensitive material with a colleague that we had both signed an NDA for. The driver turned off the dash cam for us. Another time I was refused and had to cancel and take a different ride.
Two party only means that all parties must be INFORMED. So long as the camera is VISIBLE and there is at least one sign stating that recording is IN PROGRESS, then the requirement to INFORM is achieved. PERIOD. The Paxhole's sole option to opt-out is to get the F&(# out of my car.
As far as having a conversation regarding sensitive material: In the earshot of the driver, it DOES NOT MATTER if I am recording or NOT—that is a rank STUPID thing to do. I drive but I am also a "recovering journalist". Damn straight you talk about privileged things in my presence, if it leads to a great story, then thank you for the inside information for free and read about it in the Times next week LOL.
WTF are you even thinking here? I as a driver am NOT going to sign your NDA and you DO NOT have an "expectation of privacy" when ME the DRIVER is present. Are you daft?
You may ask. I may have you recorded asking and comply. Most likely I would turn the inside camera away if you asked and more likely if there was daylight.d Especially if you were talking about sensitve business. Most cameras loop and record over each segment once the drive is full... unless tagged. Occasionally some people can get toxic and aggresive or even try to grope the driver. If there are cameras inside, it is for our protection. Just to be clear... what you are asking us is to lower our defenses and any kind of passive security and trust that you wont be agressive, try to sexually assault, hurt, or falsely accuse us, vandalize our cars, break the law, be verbally abusive, or lie about what was said. I would feel more comfortable with a driver that has a camera rather than a weapon for their protection.
Still, depending on the situation, I think most of us would consider complying.
Common sense is not so common. That's my answer for your stupid question
You can ask, but I don't think you can force them to shut it off. As you mentioned, the car is their private property, so it's like being in theiri home.
However, I am sure you have the right to NOT take the ride. No, I am not trying to be mean. It's just about coming to an agreement between you and the driver.
Oklahoma here.
Oklahoma’s Security of Communications Act provides that it is illegal to record an in-person or telephone communication without the consent of at least one party or to record a communication with criminal or tortious intent. Illegal recording is a felony punishable by fine and/or imprisonment.
The driver counts as a party in this case and as such does not have to inform or cancel the recording for any purpose.
Esit: Misspelled Oklahoma lol.
You should not be worried about being recorded, if you are not doing anything wrong. Most drivers state it's for their safety purposes (as some have already mentioned here) so you can bet that the recording will not go anywhere. I know in the past there have been stories.. but I think that is rare.
What about if you have to discuss sensitive material? You absolutely have the right to ask not to have audio recorded. Especially in two party states. In fact if there isn't any sign in indicating you are recording audio in PA, you can be fined up to $15k and possibly serve jailtime.
It all depends which state you live in. Texas is a one party consent state which means only one person has to consent therefore the driver can legally record with or without your consent. If the state you live in is a two party consent state then the driver must have your consent to record.
You certainly have the rite to request it be turned off, however do so with the understanding that the driver has the right to refuse you the ride, which will result in you having to request another car/driver.
The driver has the right to refuse, the passenger has a right to request. But never lose sight of the fact that the driver is protecting YOU as much as they're protecting themselves. Many cameras have both forward and backward viewing, so many drivers are more interested in the capturing the forward view in case of an accident.
No you do NOT that privilege to force a driver to anything you want . No shortage of stupid people.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2019/11/20/technology/uber-recording-rides-privacy.amp.html
Here is just one reason drivers need dash cams.
https://weartv.com/news/local/lyft-driver-says-he-was-assaulted-by-passenger
As long as you willingly entered my car knowing that there's a dashcam you will be recorded no exceptions. Wherever you go you're being recorded So if you don't want to be on camera I suggest moving off grid
There is a difference between recording video and recoding someone's conversation.
People dont want ti be recorded in our cars but do they realize almost everywhere you go you are being recoded? I have a few private patientsI I take care of. Obviously I am not there 24/7 so there are agency staff that comes in. These people have caneras in their house. Rightfully so they do not know these nurses coming in. Their loved ones are incapable of protecting themselves. When you allow strangers in to your car, home, and office cameras are important. When I first started seeing cameras in these peoples homes I was a little uncomfortable but I understood why they were there. If riders get into our cars and there is a dash cam why would you have a problem with it? It's for the drivers safety as well as passengers. You as a passenger wants to be safe shouldn't the driver be able to protect themselves? Why would you want to take that away from a driver? Is your life more important as a passenger? How long are you in an Uber 10/60 min? What are you doing during that times…
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People dont want ti be recorded in our cars but do they realize almost everywhere you go you are being recoded? I have a few private patientsI I take care of. Obviously I am not there 24/7 so there are agency staff that comes in. These people have caneras in their house. Rightfully so they do not know these nurses coming in. Their loved ones are incapable of protecting themselves. When you allow strangers in to your car, home, and office cameras are important. When I first started seeing cameras in these peoples homes I was a little uncomfortable but I understood why they were there. If riders get into our cars and there is a dash cam why would you have a problem with it? It's for the drivers safety as well as passengers. You as a passenger wants to be safe shouldn't the driver be able to protect themselves? Why would you want to take that away from a driver? Is your life more important as a passenger? How long are you in an Uber 10/60 min? What are you doing during that times that you want driver to shut camera off. If your on the phone and dont want your conversation recorded hello the driver can still hear you. Save private conversation for the appropriate places or text. I dont understand what you are doing or saying that being recorded would be an issue for you. I get it may be uncomfortable but I can assure you most drivers go home download the day and never look at it again. I save footage for 30/60 days and then I get rid of it. I never go home and go over footage for the day unless their was an issue. I have not had to look over any footage to date. I dont have the time and no one that gets into my car is that important to me for me to care to look over it. If someone had an important business call and asked me to turn it off I would be ok with that. Again you should really save sensitive/private conversation for your home or office. Have some respect & understanding for your driver. Realize we pick up strangers all day and night we are far from safe out there. We want to go home to our husbands, wives, children, family, and friends at the end of our shift. We also want proof when riders send false accusations to Uber or Lyft it happens all the time. How would you feek if one day you went to work inky to be told you were fired? Sime steanger walked off the street lied and said you did something thst you didnt do. It also can help in accidents. Just realize life isnt just all about 1 person everyone deserves to be/feel safe.
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Ya get OUT THE PERSON CAR.
Great thread.
I am a fellow Uber and Lyft driver myself and I had an incident with a group of intoxicated passengers that could have cost me my privileges on Uber. The reason I installed the dash cam is because if an incident comes up I don't want there to be a misunderstanding over what actually happened. Some people actually file false complaints to the Rideshare company when you tell them no and actually enforced policy. I have to tell you that most of my passengers have been very accepting and supportive of me and are glad that I have security. I have posted signs warning people that audio and video recording may be in progress in this vehicle. I also will answer questions about the surveillance and inform them of why I have it and what it's used for. I would never post any footage on YouTube or any social media. The video is for security only it's not designed to embarrass or bring humiliation to anyone. I'm not trying to embarrass my passengers or create an uncomfortable situa…
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I am a fellow Uber and Lyft driver myself and I had an incident with a group of intoxicated passengers that could have cost me my privileges on Uber. The reason I installed the dash cam is because if an incident comes up I don't want there to be a misunderstanding over what actually happened. Some people actually file false complaints to the Rideshare company when you tell them no and actually enforced policy. I have to tell you that most of my passengers have been very accepting and supportive of me and are glad that I have security. I have posted signs warning people that audio and video recording may be in progress in this vehicle. I also will answer questions about the surveillance and inform them of why I have it and what it's used for. I would never post any footage on YouTube or any social media. The video is for security only it's not designed to embarrass or bring humiliation to anyone. I'm not trying to embarrass my passengers or create an uncomfortable situation but I have a right to protect my business as any other business owner does. I have four signs ONE posted at each door. if I think somebody may not understand the signs I will also explain it orally. A Rideshare vehicle is privately owned property not owned by the companies and as the owner of my property I have the right to install and use security measures provided I'm not breaking any laws doing it.
if somebody doesn't consent to audio or video recording or use of a dash cam. They have a right not to consent to your conversation however your vehicle is private property. You have a right to end their trip in a safe location early if they don't consent. It's no different than going to the airport and wanting to get on an airplane without going through security. You have an absolute right to refuse the passengers screening but they have an absolute right not to allow you to board that aircraft or remain on Airport property.
if you go to any concert venue or any other place that has metal detectors or bag checks and you don't consent to it. They have a right to refuse you admission.
A Rideshare driver owns the vehicle that they are using and as long as the security they are doing is lawful. The driver is within his or her right to refuse service for failure to comply with security policies. When you're doing ride-sharing you're out there by yourself and you never know who you're picking up. The sad part is the vast majority of people you serve aren't the ones you have to worry about. It's less than 5% but only one of them can cost you a contract if they make a false allegation to Uber or Lyft or any of the other providers.
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It is true that in a private place like someone else's car, you do not have a reasonable expectation of privacy. This means the driver can record you.
With that said, I don't think it matters whether you are in private or public places when it comes to recording your private conversations. In most states, the recoding party needs to have some kind of consent. I think. I am not lawyer.
Right. The whole wiretap statute. Though I believe that only stands true if the party has a legitimate expectation of privacy. In a public place, people usually don't. However, in some one else's car?
Your rights are dependent upon the state you reside in. Ohio is a one party state and therefore it is up to the driver to decide here if they wouldn’t mind not recording you. However as long as you’re not doing anything you’re not supposed to I don’t see the issue with being recorded. Drivers only have it in their vehicles as a safety precaution. Not to do anything weird. Most videos left untouched are overwritten by new video content. So chances are they don’t even have it anymore.
Webcam? Or dashcam? Depends on what state you're in. But certainly you can ask not to be recorded, however you may get denied the ride.